Re: ADMIN: More on upcoming list changes--READ ME

["Brierley, Sean" <Brierley -at- QUODATA -dot- COM>]

Hallo:

>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>From: Eric J. Ray [mailto:ejray -at- RAYCOMM -dot- COM]
>>>Sent: Tuesday, August 03, 1999 4:28 PM

>>>However, the response
>>>to these options has been distinctly less than overwhelming.

I read three posts from you about moving the list but missed the part about
the need for feedback. Indeed, I took your posts as information about a done
deal and assumed you had support for the move, including some sponsors and
ad space pre-sold.

I don't need ad space. Neither does my employer. Perhaps Andrew Plato and a
few other entrepreneurial types do? Andrew? How about some STC support for
this? I saw a post from a Boston-Chapter member earlier.

I wouldn't mind paying $10 for service. However, I suspect the overhead of
managing the subscription would be a pain. Like Jason, I would pay before
the list move occurred, but how? (And, I'd expect any self-respecting list
admin to nail Jason and his mother-in-law to the wall for the his <vbg>.)

For ease of overhead, I'd recommend moving to onelist or some other free
service. If the list took longer to load, refresh, or suffered spontaneous
disappearance of some posts (including my own), I could live with that.

So, my vote:

1. Onelist or similar.
2. I'll pay for service.
3. Those who run successful companies, jump on the ad space!
4. Let's get some STC support! At least, some STC advertising.

Stay safe,

Sean
sean -at- quodata -dot- com

>>>Here are the givens:
>>>Moving TECHWR-L to a dedicated list host would cost (at list prices)
>>>up to $36,000/month (that's not a typo). Realistically speaking,
>>>after negotiations and shopping around, we'd be looking at costs
>>>of around $600-$700/month for server access alone.
>>>
>>>Moving TECHWR-L to a new server (co-located somewhere) and
>>>purchasing and administering the software ourselves would
>>>cost around $400 - $500/month, plus $3000 up front for software.
>>>This would allow additional lists (on focused topics or just
>>>for chatting) and support additional services as appropriate,
>>>but require more administration overhead.
>>>
>>>Moving TECHWR-L to Onelist or the like would cost nearly
>>>nothing. YMMV when it comes to free list hosting services, but
>>>we've seen frequent (weekly or more often) delays in posting
>>>and random messages that vanish and reappear. This might be
>>>acceptable, or might not. We don't know.
>>>
>>>Closing TECHWR-L down would cost exactly nothing.
>>>
>>>And other issues to consider:
>>>Raycomm, Inc., will not subsidize this level of costs for TECHWR-L.
>>>Since I started the list, I've done it for nothing more than
>>>thank yous, and Deb's done the same with the Web site.
>>>Conservatively,
>>>we put in about 200 hours/year on TECHWR-L (which is time that
>>>we're not billing to clients, so could be considered a donation of
>>>_well_ over $10,000 annually). That's fine--that was my
>>>choice when I started the list, and Deb's when she started
>>>work on the Web site. For both of us, that's a service that we're
>>>happy to provide to the community. However, RayComm, Inc., will not
>>>pay $6000+ in direct costs annually to keep TECHWR-L going.
>>>
>>>Options that we've considered as viable include:
>>>* accepting donations of server or co-location space
>>>* accepting a donation of the necessary software (Lyris or Listserv
>>>        would be required to provide this level of service)
>>>* accepting other contributions in the form of memberships,
>>>        sponsorships, etc.
>>>   (Obviously, all of the above would be amply acknowledged
>>>        on the list and on the site)
>>>* moving the list to Onelist or a similar service
>>>* shutting down the list completely
>>>
>>>There are undoubtedly other alternatives that we haven't considered,
>>>and most of the options above have substantial downsides
>>>(e.g., if the server is co-located at a company with a
>>>substantial consulting, writing, or software development
>>>presence, would the list be able to continue to be a fully
>>>impartial discussion forum?). However, the bottom line
>>>is that the list must move, RayComm won't absorb the costs,
>>>and RayComm won't take a substantial gamble that the
>>>costs will somehow be covered before the bills are due.
>>>
>>>Consider this _open_ for discussion on the list, or feel
>>>free to comment to me or Deb offline (ejray -at- raycomm -dot- com,
>>>debray -at- raycomm -dot- com).
>>>
>>>Eric
>>>
>>>
>>>--
>>>^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>>>Eric J. Ray                  ejray -at- raycomm -dot- com
>>>TECHWR-L Listowner
>>>
>>>=============================================================
>>>==============
>>>Send commands to listserv -at- listserv -dot- okstate -dot- edu (e.g.,
>>>SIGNOFF TECHWR-L)
>>>
>>>
>>>

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